Coupla Things

and some questions…

First: Who didn’t see this coming?!?

If a country allows Political Violence to occur unopposed, more Political Violence will be encouraged.

If said Political Violence originates from one political side, those on the other political side will feel left out and begin to participate.

NB Those who commit Political Violence are, by definition, extremists. People with regular lives, jobs/businesses, homes, kids, etc have too much to lose. As Papa said, never hang out with people who have nothing to lose.

Second: Since when did “we” decide that a person’s actions ought to be judged on the basis of his beliefs. The Law judges behavior. Period.

Murder is wrong. Murder is illegal. It’s not relevant if the murdered person said something horrifyingly insulting. It is not relevant if the murdered person believes something morally repugnant. Murder is illegal and must be prevented or punished if a civilization would wish to conduct normal business and have any ability to create and prosper.

Same goes for assault, theft, and destruction of others’ property. There is no way a civilization can function if those mis-behaviors are not swiftly, clearly, and consistently prevented / punished.

That idea was once considered Civilization 101: now it seems to be obscure and arcane knowledge.

Somebody please ‘splain to me how this is “defending White Supremacists”?

Trump: I will tell you something. I watched those very closely, much more closely than you people watched it, and you have- You had a group on one side that was bad and you had a group on the other side that was also very violent. And nobody wants to say that, but I’ll say it right now. You had a group, you had a group on the other side that came charging in without a permit and they were very, very violent.

Reporter: Do you think what you call the alt-left is the same as neo-Nazis?

Trump: Those people, all of those people- excuse me. I’ve condemned neo-Nazis. I’ve condemned many different groups, but not all of those people were neo-Nazis, believe me. Not all of those people were white supremacists, by any stretch.

Reporter: Well, white nationalists-
[look -- this is how/where/when the language gets changed. e~C]

Trump: Those people were also there because they wanted to protest the taking down of a statue of Robert E. Lee. So … Excuse me. And you take a look at some of the groups and you see and you’d know it if you were honest reporters — which in many cases you’re not. But many of those people were there to protest the taking down of the statue of Robert E. Lee. So, this week it’s Robert E. Lee. I noticed that Stonewall Jackson is coming down. I wonder is it George Washington next week and is it Thomas Jefferson the week after? You know, you really do have to ask yourself where does it stop? But they were there to protest- excuse me. you take a look the night before, they were there to protest the taking down of the statue of the Robert E. Lee. Infrastructure question. Go ahead.

Good question. Almost foreshadowing…

Reporter: Mr. President, are you putting what you’re calling the alt-left and white supremacists on the same moral plane?

Trump: I’m not putting anybody on a moral plane. What I’m saying is this: You had a group on one side and you had a group on the other and they came at each other with clubs and it was vicious and it was horrible and it was a horrible thing to watch, but there is another side. There was a group on this side — you can call them the left, you’ve just called them the left — that came violently attacking the other group, so you can say what you want but that’s the way it is.

Here, PDT is addressing the behavior — no matter the political leanings and ‘Moral plane’ of the participants. That is a separate discussion. But he is not articulate enough to ‘splain it clearly enough for those who don’t already understand to get a whiff of a hint of a clue of the actual issue at hand. *facepalm*

Trump: Well, I do think there’s blame- Yes. I do think there’s blame on both sides. You look at both sides. I think there’s blame on both sides and I have no doubt about it and you don’t have any doubt about it either and- and- and- and if you reported it accurately, you would say it.

Reporter: Neo-Nazis started this in Charlottesville. They showed up at Charlottesville, they-

Trump: Excuse me.

Reporter: To protest the removal of that-

Trump: [Inaudible.] You have some very bad people in that group, but you also had people that were very fine people on both sides. You had people in that group — excuse me, excuse me — I saw the same pictures as you did. You had people in that group that were there to protest the taking down of, to them, a very, very important statue and the renaming of a park from Robert E. Lee to another name.

Reporter: Do you support white nationalists, then?

Are you f’n kidding??? That is the conclusion you got from his words??!? Or one you came into the room holding dear in your pocket?

These are the same people who used to whinge about “lack of nuance.” Yet they are unable to consider that there were people of more than two dare I say? Black and White philosophies present in that group of thousands of people.

When a civilization judges behavior, it does so — must do so — on the basis of Individual Behavior. Now an attempt is being made to change that to where an individual’s behavior is considered on the basis of their Identity Group™. That cannot possibly work. If all individuals are not Equal Before The Law, we devolve to feudal factions with privileged classes and purchased indulgences, then into simple tribal warfare. It’s the idea most counter to American Values I can think of. Now we’re just fighting over who gets to be the winning Identity Group.

In the streets.

As to the “Moral Plane”: Some Many seem to be implying that because the Values of one side are repugnant — and they are — that the behavior of that side is more reputnant — and ought to be less tolerated — than the same behavior of the other group — which is somehow to be tolerated. Ridiculous.

As to the Values of the other side, being Against Free Speech, being intent to enforce their views By Any Means Necessary [BAMN], being in favor of one race and offended to the point of violence at any suggestion that the lives of any other races matter
doesn’t seem *to me* to give them any Moral Highground.

Aside: Incidentally, I think it is completely stupid to remove any historic monuments. Destroying your own History — both the admirable and not so admirable parts — is suicide.

We already removed the History of the Civil War from school books — it’s hard to find any balanced, un-revised books as an adult. [any recommendations would be welcomed, btw]

Howinhell are we going prevent a repetiton of History if we can’t even learn about it — if we try to erase its very existence only to replace it with a bumper-stickered version??!?

Finish your assignment! »
Kerfluffel warning — this part:

Trump: Excuse me, what about the alt-left that came charging at the, as you say, the alt-right. Do they have any semblance of guilt?

[Cross talk. Reporters shout questions.]

Trump: Let me ask you this. What about the fact they came charging — that they came charging, with clubs in their hands, swinging clubs? Do they have any problem? I think they do. So, you know, as far as I’m concerned, that was a horrible, horrible day-

Transcripts vary according to the skills — and apparently intent — of the transcribers. There is a kerfluffel of intention to misreport [Fake Nooz!!] that part that has Trump saying “what about the alt-left that came charging at us — excuse me — what about…

Daily Caller covers it well — with video — and it’s worth the time — just to remind us never to believe what you hear first. …or second, or third.



  1. DougM (flawed chap)
    Posted August 16, 2017 at 10:25 am |

    Well thunk and well writ, Claire.
    You outlined and specified some very fundamental truths
    (and all within my TL;DR parameters).
    Can’t disagree with any of it, and that’s rare.

    There was only one phrase missing: “Bend the knee,”
    but that would have necessitated another paragraph.
    (What? Yeahhh, there might be a cartoon in that.)

  2. Posted August 16, 2017 at 2:17 pm |

    Well stated. The destruction of historical artifacts does nothing to change history; it simply removes the ability of others to learn from it.

    But then, those people doing the destroying don’t believe in learning, anyway.

  3. Blake
    Posted August 16, 2017 at 5:15 pm |

    President Trump: “The sky is blue.”

    Stupid reporter: “So, you support White Supremacists?”

  4. Claire: rebellious pink pig with car keys - and a *cause*
    Posted August 16, 2017 at 9:06 pm |

    ThanQ, DM
    I was stretching my own TL;DR parameters.

    This thing has so many aspects and so many tentacles — and so much outright ignorant buffoonery and agenda-driven misinterpretation that a multiple PhD thesis-length research papers would be inadequate.

    mainly, tho, I’m madder ‘n a wet hen at all the disrespect.

  5. Bruce
    Posted August 17, 2017 at 4:13 pm |

    Be interesting to find out how many of these scumbags are closet owners of statues, (and/or the collected works), of Lenin or Stalin (or Trotsky).